I need some help refining a concept please. I’m working on Issue 2 of my Session Zero zine, inspired by Skyrim. One prominent thing in Skyrim is potions; they’re everywhere!
I want it to act similarly to – but not exactly – the Barbarian’s Herculean Appetites, but I feel what I have sounds strange. I want the move to include both a good effect and a duration…
For example:
Potion of Strength – Applied, 0 Weight, 1 use, 10 coins
They taste awful, but sometimes the difference between life and death hinges on the right potion at the right time. When you roll for a STR-based move after drinking a Potion of Strength, instead of rolling 2d6, roll 1d6 + 1d8. Treat results of 6- as 7-9, and results of 7-9 as 10+. This effect ends after a roll in which the d6 is the higher of the pair.
It just feels too mechanical (but so does the Herculean Appetites IMO)
Potion of Magic works the same, but would trigger “When you cast a spell”, and something like Potion of True Shot would trigger “When you Volley”.
Is there a better way to say this? Thanks in advance!
Yes, I love the mechanic, but it is a bit wordy… Possibly something along the lines of…
When you drink a potion of strength, roll 1d6+1d8 instead of the normal 2d6. If the d8 is the higher of the two, count results of 6- as a 7-9, and results of 7-9 as 10+. If the d6 is the higher, the effects of the potion end.
It’s wordy, but it’s very clear, and I think it sounds really cool. I like the idea of the effect duration being unpredictable that way.
Bobby Joe, I like the simplification, but I want the “result increase” to always happen. You get a better chance of rolling higher and also the range shift. I thought about doing it with 2d6 and 1d4 (where the 1d4 isn’t added and is only there for the comparison. If it’s higher than either d6 the effect ends, but that was even wordier)
How about: When you drink a potion of strength, until the effect ends roll 1d6 + 1d8 when making STR-based rolls instead of 2d6. [Range Shift stuff]. [Effect End Stuff].
Agree with above posts. The move is mechanically great. And potions of these types will be more mechanically founded.
Its also wordy. I like Bobby Joe’s changes. Id go even further however.
When you drink a potion of strength replace a 1d6 with a 1d8 when rolling with STR. If the d8 is the higher of the two, count results of 6- as a 7-9, and results of 7-9 as 10+. Otherwise the effects of the potion end.
Just some word changes to reduce the number of words and clarify that its an ongoing effect.
On further thought, I don’t think I like that because the trigger is now drinking the potion. The trigger should be the move you’re making…
Made that change as you were posting lol
Robert Doe I like that, but Bobby Joe
and Robert is there a way to reduce the words while still making the trigger the move you’re making rather than drinking the potion?
When you roll for a STR-based move after drinking a Potion of Strength roll 1d6 + 1d8. If the d6 is the higher of the two count results of 6- as a 7-9, and results of 7-9 as 10+. Otherwise the effects of the potion end.
You can functionally, but fictionally wouldn’t a character feel and look stronger once the potion is used, not just when performing a move?
Yep that works just fine. At this point its personally taste.
Oh, i would also change yours slightly to be inline with the fact its a continuous affect.
When you roll for any STR based moves
Actually Robert I just saw the change you made to your move above, and that works really well.
IF you drink a potion
THEN your rolls will be d6+d8
AND
IF your d8 is higher
THEN increase your range
ELSE the effect ends
That’s much more economic!
Definitely… any STR-based move!!
Thanks everyone!
Thankyou.
You’ve got yourself some cool moves for your zine. Excited to See it
Have you checked out The Smoldering Swamp yet? It felt good to get that done, and I learned a lot about layout etc. while working on it, so The Barrow will be easier to put together!
Skyrim has a lot of things that I have to find interesting ways to pull off mechanically with DW. Potions, Rings & Necklaces and Skill Books to name a few. They won’t be as common in DW as they are in Skyrim (I have crafted and sold more potions in the 400+ hours of Skyrim I’ve played over the past few years than you will see in all games of DW in the entire world), but I still want them to be mechanically the best they can. I want it to be somewhat of a template so that even though I’ll only have 3 potions in the zine they’ll all work basically the same so you can build your own for whatever your story needs.
Lol yea thats Alot of crafting.
And i enjoy your style of writing. It relates to my own.
I also thought your questions to start the session zero (great name for the zine by the way) are nice. Personally those questions, for any starter not just your own, are the most crucial. The game after all is a story and we have to bring the players together and make them want to be there. Id go as far as to include more questions, some that are geared directly to a class nitch (not a class name, but the nitch itself).
The Barrow won’t exactly have niche-specific questions, but it will have more questions and have more ways to highlight a niche and also fill holes in the party.
Potion of Magic highlights the Wizard and Cleric, while a Ring of Lock Picking gives a player a modified Tricks of the Trade move. It’s not there to walk on the Thief (so as the GM you give a different ring if there’s a Thief in the party), but it’s there to fill the lock picking hole (because that’s another big thing in Skyrim LOL).
A Staff of Fireball (although I still haven’t decided whether or not that one will make the cut) can fill a Wizard hole.
On that note, I think I’m going to treat “charges” on a staff like ammo. You can choose to use a “charge” on a 7-9 as with Volley, and when you’re out of charges it’s just a mundane staff.
What are your thoughts on that?
More questions will only help the Zine.
Sense you wont have Niche specific questions. Id suggest, if you haven’t already, provide questions for the players whenever a specific item is provided to them at the beginning of the game. That staff of fireball for example. How did you come by the staff? How does the staff affect the senses just before it discharges (look, sound, smell, etc)? What means of hardship must you endure before the Staff may be recharged?
Just some questions to help facilitate fiction with the items.
As for handeling charges like Ammo. Yes, yes and more yes. I myself have been handling more and more resources like that. Volley is such an elligant move. Sometimes its a combination of Volley and Cast a Spell.
Yeah, they’ll be like (some) of the items I have in The Smoldering Swamp. Even if an item doesn’t specify questions you can almost always ask 3 or 4 questions about it (or the niche questions) based on your fiction.
I just don’t want to front-load so many questions that you spend four hours building the world and not get to play (but it is Session Zero after all, and that’s fun too).
I’m heading to bed. Thanks for your help Robert!
What if you just did something like you roll 2d8 and on a 6- the effect ends. This would be statistically very similar, you still get the novelty of rolling bigger dice, and the ending condition is not a new thing to check for. For reference here’s an anydice program that compares a wide variety of different bonuses evaluated with the PbtA rubric, 0=6-, 1=7-9, 2=10+ http://anydice.com/program/b662/transposed/graph
Unfortunately, it doesn’t have odds for when a d6 is higher than the d8, that’s actually kind of a pain to calculate with anydice.
So here’s a question – what happens if a Barbarian drinks a Potion of Strength and then makes a STR-based move while pursuing one of his or her appetites? 🙂
Ah! So over on The Sprawl community (another PbtA hack) someone is discussing a way to create useful drugs (aka Cyberpunk potions). While the tone of the move they made is darker, I think it’s worth looking at for another take on this concept that might inspire you: plus.google.com – Greetings fellow edge runners. I’m new here so a little introduction first. M…
Robert Rendell Strength-ception! But seriously that is a good question! If it were me, I would probably tell the barbarian that the strength potion and his appetites still just give him a d6 + d8, but he is getting the range increase from the potion still until the first time his d6 is higher than his d8. Of course it would only be on STR based moves, while appetites goes for any move.
Thanks Nick Nunes, I’m going to take a look at that right now. After thinking about this, the roll could stay at 2d6, the range shift always happens (because you should get one use out of it), and the “end effect trigger” is the 6- roll. This speaks to Robert Rendell’s questions as well…
Robert, that’s a good question! If I keep the roll a standard 2d6 (see above) then the Herculean Appetite move is unchanged!
Erandi Huipe, I’m going to take a look at that as well!
Thanks all!
Scott Selvidge that’s a good point too!
When you drink a potion of strength, when rolling any STR-based moves count 6- as 7-9 and 7-9 as 10+. This effect end’s on a 6-.
How does this sound? You get the result shift without adding the d8, and the effect can end “naturally” with a “normal” fail.
Brian Holland I would prefer the text, “After you drink a potion of strength, when rolling any STR based moves …”. Also it isn’t necessary to put in your text, but the effect could also be taken away like any resource by the GM.
And as an aside, you could still have the d8, but make it end as you have it now.
Here’s a different approach (of course I think of this right as I’m heading to bed, so I won’t be able to respond to anything for several hours)…
I don’t usually like an automatic success being bandied about, but I think it may work with a one-time use item like a potion without being too overpowered. Potions in DW are not NEARLY as common as they are in Skyrim.
Potion of Strength – 1 use
When you drink a potion of strength you feel raw power coursing through your veins. The next time you make a STR-based move don’t roll and count the result as 12. (12 because that matters for moves like Smash!, The one who knocks, and Superior warrior)
Potion of Casting – 1 use
When you drink a potion of casting your mind enters a new state of understanding. The next time you Cast a spell don’t roll and count the result as 12 (for Greater Empower and Greater Empowered Magic)
I’m not 100% sure I’ll go this way because I like the uncertainty of the variable duration with the original moves, but I also feel that it feels correct fictionally. If you’re holding onto the potion for just the right moment during battle to get the killing blow or to ensure Fireball goes off it will likely be a Defy Danger just to drink it.
It’s still possible to have a variable duration by rolling as normal but always counting the result as 12. If you roll a double (or just a 6-?) the effect ends and you take d8 (or whatever) damage as a downside; it represents wear and tear due to the prolonged effects of the potion (like adrenaline… you can punch through a car window and not feel that you broke every bone in your hand until the adrenaline wears off)
Just some thoughts…I’m probably overthinking it because I’m tired lol. ‘Night all!
Not that its needed, but something else to consider when making potential potions are downsides. That can be in the form of addictions (need it again or you feel weak), sickness (hangover) or even permanent tolls on the body/mind.
There was a post i read a while back dealing with this kind of thing and cannot for the life of me remember who or where i saw it. Maybe another does?
Anyway, good stuff all around!